Grammar pet peeve

I see this mistake EVERYWHERE & it really bugs me: He's older than me, instead of I. It's so prevelent I'm beginning to think the rules have changed. Have they??? What's your pet peeve?

This is actually correct. 'He' is the subject of the sentence, so the other person takes the accusative 'me' rather than the nominative 'I'. (Same as writing 'He is older than her', rather than 'He is older than she'.)

My biggest peeve is confusing of the verbs 'to lie' and 'to lay'. It really sets my teeth on edge.

Hmmmm... I agree with the OP. There is an unwritten end to the sentence. He is older than I (am old). or ... than she (is old). That's how I learned it, and I still have my clay tablets (funny how we're back to using tablets again...) from back then.

One thing that did change (back in the 80s) apparently, is the inclusion of a comma before the conjunction in a series -- Huey, Dewey, and Louie.

What bugs me most isn't grammar; it's punctuation. Publishers want a single space between the punctuation mark and the first letter of the next sentence. (LT forces it, by the way.) It makes no sense to me. Paragraphs look like they could be one long sentence peppered with extended abbreviations.

Now you got me started!

3: 'He is older than I am' would be correct, certainly, because there are two verbs each with its own subject. IMO, 'He is older than me' would also be correct, because there's one verb, one subject and one object. (I don't think a second verb is implied because, grammatically, you don't need one to make a comparison.)

Re. single spaces between sentences: it's not LT that enforces that, it's HTML (which collapses multiple spaces). If you want more than one, you can insert a non-breaking space character:  . (That's not really good Web practice, though.)

gad, I miss transformational grammar. I can't tolerate a universe where native speakers employ a different grammar than me (do.)

and when did the subjunctive tense disappear?

The subjunctive mood is a disappearance I feel all the time. Hate, hate, hate the fact that people don't know the difference between may and might.

Unless you're in the South, in which case you have the "might could" mood. I once heard my aunt say, "We might could go to Cracker Barrel for lunch, since we're going to be in town."

Oh, yes, you get might could in the midwest, too. I loved that when I lived there. It was so evocative!!

I confess to loving colloquialisms, especially in my beloved south where we're fixin' to go places and waitin' on people instead of for them. Thanks for clearing up about "...than I" and "...than me." :-)

My biggest, at present, is anything to do with comma usage. And it's not so much in other people's work as in my own. I just cannot figure out how to properly use commas! If I could, I'd just get rid of commas entirely and force people to try to figure out what I mean.

and so he turns
to poetry

HA! **spews coffee all over the keyboard and screen**

> older than me/I

It depends on whether you analyze than as a connective between two clauses (like because, but, or) or like a preposition (like at, to, by, between, in). Following a preposition you use me, her, him etc; after a connective and an elided clause you can use I, she, he etc. It's interesting that I never see things like "he is older than she" (only with another verb following: "he is older than she is/claims to be/..."): for third person than seems to be a preposition only. Yet this re-analysis of than as a preposition is apparently not complete in the first person singular.

And now of course, several people will correct me and point me to several dialects and variants of English where "older than she" is common. I'd be interested in knowing about those, in fact.

A strange but not uncommon error is the use of prevaricate (to lie) for procrastinate (to delay one's action.) Seems particularly common with British writers.

One that has exploded in frequency in the last few years is

"There's...(plural)."

E.g., "There's a lot of swans on the lake today."

GAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!! Hate! This! So! Much!

"There ARE a lot of swans on the lake today." ARE!

God, but this sets my teeth on edge.

"There's a lot…"

If dialog, acceptable. If narrative, not.

Actually, the examples I really had in mind were, e.g., "There's seven swans..."

Ones involving "a lot" aren't good examples, because one could see that as singular, like "There's a set of..." So, bad example on my part in 15.

Yes! Commas! Although I love them because I understand them. Misused commas are my biggest pet peeve.
And that comma before the conjunction in a series is actually optional. It's called the Oxford comma, and some people prefer to use it while others prefer to leave it out. The only rule is consistency. Personally, I'm an advocate; it makes more sense to me to have peanut butter, jelly, and bread than peanut butter and jellyandbread. Without the comma, they feel jammed up.

I consider commas in fiction should be placed by need rather than rule. That is, if in reading aloud the text seems to call for a pause to gain clarity or even allow catching a breath, you have a pretty good excuse to add one. On the other hand, use of fewer is better than more because excessive commas can also slow reading.

As for swans, "There's…" is obviously ungrammatical. But in dialog anything goes if your character's speech seems to demand it.

By and large I feel we too often allow "experts" to decide usage. English wasn't designed by a colloquy of experts, and is in constant revision anyway.

#3 The comma before the and in a list is now called the "Oxford Comma" and is considered optional in most styles, provided you're consistant. (Oh, like #18 said...)

#15

Actually, I've seen "Theirs a lot of swans..." which makes it a bigger pet peeve than "There's..."

> 19 I consider commas in fiction should be placed by need rather than rule. That is, if in reading aloud the text seems to call for a pause to gain clarity or even allow catching a breath, you have a pretty good excuse to add one.

I smiled as I read that, because -- around the time I was 14 or 15, and first beginning to work seriously at my writing -- my dad (an English teacher, publicist, poet, and amateur actor/singer) gave me that very advice: "Listen to the rhythm of the sentence: Comma for a small pause, semi-colon for a medium pause, period for a big one." I'm over 50 now, and use the advice still . . .

Thanks for bringing back a happy memory. :-)

I'm impressed by The Complete Plain Words by Gowers. It's been revised by a couple of folks but they don't appear to have done too much damage. It has a chapter on punctuation.

In common with ABVR, I use punctuation as musical notation, to record the way I hear what I'm writing and would read it aloud. There is some degree of correctness at work, but it doesn't stand in the way. The main thing is that the reader is not confused or misled by my usage.

I see where you're coming from, and I disagree. I believe rules should be broken with intent instead of simply because it seems right at the time. The very beauty of grammar is in the art of when you use it and when you don't. If you simply put a comma where you feel the rules should put it, you can't start purposefully leaving them out of whole paragraphs to convey the desperation a character is feeling, for instance.

espadrile— I don't understand. "I believe rules should be broken with intent instead of simply because it seems right at the time."

Could you say a bit more about the difference between intent and what seems right at the time? Examples?

I dunno. Maybe I'm just reading wrong. I think what got me, was the commas where you would pause when reading, because what that makes me think of is, the way high school students do that when they don't know how to use commas, and that, like this sentence, looks rather dumb, and serves no literary purpose other that to confuse someone who does, in fact, know how to use a comma. But when you point that out, bitser, there really isn't a difference the way I'd said it; I was making assumptions.

Not trying to undercut what you say, just genuinely curious. Reading 18th and 19th century English works, I'm acutely conscious of what I think of as the hypercommafication. While a studied po-mo absence of commas and other punctuation is also something I notice, and most often find annoying.

The latter is more a matter of intent, I think.

Hey, bitser, I put commas before 'and' sometimes but I thought it was incorrect. Perhaps the pedants could tell us if we ask in that group?

If you have series of conjunctions, the commas distinguish what goes with what. F'rinstance:

Being inclined to all manner of magic, she liked white and black, blood and water, conjuring and disappearing, and above all, love and betrayal.

Reminds me of:

Caesar entered on his head
his helmet on his foot
a sandal in his hand he had
his trusty sword to boot.

Or with commas:

Caesar entered, on his head his helmet, on his foot a sandal, in his hand he had his trusty sword, to boot.

That's adorable. I've never seen that before. I love it.

I hate all the usual ones. 'Their' vs 'There', etc. The "He's older than me" (vs "I") doesn't bother me too much, though I stick to the rule in my writing. AP Style class rubbed off on me in a big way.

I hate certain archaic terms, particularly the word "whilst". I'm not sure why but it aggravates me to the point that when I see the word "while", I'll read again just to be extra sure the writer didn't use "whilst". "Amongst" bothers me to a lesser degree.

One of my pet peeves is a recent one...some editors seem to have forgotten that the word "might" exists. It's just "may" all the time, which drives me crazy. "If he hadn't been there, she may have gotten a ticket." NO. That's just WRONG.

Corporate/bureaucratic jargon irks me: concerning, visioning, to grow (whatever). A top Republican said "We have to grow our tent." Yeah, right. There's a glib imitative stupidity to it.

Since newspaper publishing went digital, there are far more typos, errors, and outlandish constructions. The New York Times used to be quite good about this, and in the last five years it's become a mess.

--32 Whilst is a popular Anglicism.

--33 I heartily agree, but it's an old problem, going back to Wilkie Collins or earlier. I know, since I'm reading After Dark now. We must each do our bit to fight for might.

--34 Bill Clinton popularized the misuse of "grow" with his "grow the economy" schtick.

>27 bitser: Reading 18th and 19th century English works, I'm acutely conscious of what I think of as the hypercommafication

I noticed that when I took a stab at Tristram Shandy.

>35 DaiAlanye: Bill Clinton popularized the misuse of "grow" with his "grow the economy" schtick.

I remember noticing that when Clinton did it as well.

Usually with this use of "grow," you can improve it by substituting "expand." I find that, er, good-enizes the sentence.

Characters that say "l" come across as pompous, unless the story is a period drama.

My Dad grew up farming and ranching in a rural area, but his mother was a schoolteacher (and a tyrant). So, for the most part he and his brothers and sisters spoke "correct" English. He would use rural dialect in telling a story about horses or ranch work or youthful pranks, but not in ordinary conversation.

#38--How do you mean?

I learned something today that made me blush. Mentally, at least.

There's an error in the sentence, "The decaying wooden bridge was prone to immanent failure." Do you see it?

Should be "imminent".

I've seen that one a few times though the words & meanings are quite obviously different to me, maybe they sound more similar in English than French ?

Yes! It makes me wonder how many times I've triggered someone's pet peeve with that one, lol. Good example where the spellchecker gives you a pass but actually, sorry: fail.

>41 Cecrow: immanent!

http://grammarist.com/usage/immanent-imminent-eminent/

New Pet Peeve!

PIN Number.
(From the office of redundancy office.)

#45 by gilroy>

Don't forget your PIN number for the ATM machine when you go out to buy a book where you only know the ISBN number.

>46 Keeline:
That's the one!

Thanks all. Now I'm really confused!

"Added bonus."

Aaaaaaargh!