Heathen Charity Work

I'll be a bit blunt.

I've been volunteering at a local Episcopal Church Food Kitchen. I believe it's called St. Paul & St. Ringo, or some sort. I was wondering, these are really great folks, but why am I always working for the other team, so to speak? Why aren't atheists actively working to help those less fortunate?

I just noticed this site:

http://americanhumanist.org/HNN/details/2011-09-an-open-letter-to-humanists-dona...

Are there others who are doing great work, for the less fortunate, out there?

Isn't that just down the street from the cemetery of St. John & St. George?

waka waka

>1 Sandydog1: why am I always working for the other team, so to speak?

Because you haven't started a food kitchen? Churches have a building and community set up, so even if they were looking at equal population, they would still have an advantage. It's going to take atheists actively making atheist food kitchens to have atheist food kitchens.

Try finding a Food Not Bombs crew if you can...

http://www.foodnotbombs.net/

Though they're less not religious than they are areligious.

Churches have the infrastructure and the numbers to attend to all sorts of charitable interests. I suspect that the Episcopal Church has other outreach programs.

How appreciative have they been to welcome your help, and how evangelizing have they been, attempting to convert you to the other side?

Feeding the poor and caring for the sick has been a directive of the Christian faith since its inception, so it isn't surprising that there is a long standing and significant infrastructure built up to serve those goals.

What's more interesting is where you don't see an overt religious presence:

--domestic violence shelters
--addiction programs
--debt relief
--environmental causes
--support for the arts

At least locally in Chattanooga, we have programs for the first two. In Chattanooga, the arts receive a lot of support. The arts is not a need which the Churches must supply.

A quick google search for religious charities debt relief, environment, domestic violence gives at least the suggestion of some organizations focusing on environment and domestic violence. A search for debt relief did not bring up a similar listing.

domestic violence

environmental

Well it's not either/or. But the odds are, if you're looking to give to an environmental cause, a religious organization is not going to be the first thing you run across.

Well, the Unitarians are pretty much pro-environment with a good smattering of atheist members.

What's more interesting is where you don't see an overt religious presence:

--domestic violence shelters

In Fairbanks the Domestic violence shelter changed their name to WICCA (I don't remember what it stood for, but something like Women Community Combating Abuse or something) and when told by churches that made it hard for them to be involved, they were told by the director to just fuck off.

Five years and a new director later they came to churches asking for money and for volunteer support. They got both. (I was a board member for a few years.)

--addiction programs

Just try finding a church that does not have an AA group meeting there. Also, there is program called Celebrate Recovery, which is essentially church for substance abusers. The whole service is designed to support people in recovery. Currently our church's youth program is composed of kids who are in residential treatment for substance abuse. Every week we get kids here who practice leather working, and learn the Bible and life skills using the Zombie Apocalypse as a discussion started. (This is a curriculum I wrote when I worked with SED kids in Fairbanks.)

--debt relief

Not quite sure what you mean by that, but that proves your point. Unless you are talking about personal debt relief, and ours and money other churches offer financial assistance to people who have short term debt problems. I have bought gas, paid for bus tickets or hotel rooms, energy bills, you name it.

But when it comes to debt relief on a larger scale, you are right.

--environmental causes

This was once true, but is slowly changing. My old Presbytery Exec (the closest thing Presbyterians have to a bishop) is VERY involved in environmental causes. He has the greenest house in Alaska, and gets congregation involved in all manner of earth care projects. Check out http://www.creationcare.org/ to see what other groups are doing. You can read an article about it here: http://www.theecologist.org/News/news_analysis/1819960/evangelical_environmental...

--support for the arts

Where else can you hear choral and organ music on a weekly basis? We put a lot of money into our organ, and every week you can hear excellent music from our organist and choir. Where else do people sing on a regular basis? Church has both participatory and performance arts going on EVERY WEEK.

Our sanctuary is used for our local symphony, our Jazz Festival concerts, and various quartets and other assorted musical events totally apart from worship on a regular basis. They use our facilities because we don't charge them. In Fairbanks our church was a huge supporter of the Fairbanks Summer Arts Festival (http://www.fsaf.org/) and housed musicians and concerts. (Just to let you know what kind of festival this is, if you want to study beginning trumpet you can spend two weeks learning with the head of the composition faculty at the Berklee conservatory in Boston.)

About a quarter of the Rogue Valley Chorale are also members of our choir. We open up our building to the Rogue Valley Harmonizers for weekly rehearsals, gratis.

I am sure that other churches have similar stories.

>11 Arctic-Stranger: Specific examples no doubt abound, but don't disprove my general point. Religious charities have traditionally focused on specific priorities and have created the general infrastructure to do so. They have a roadmap and a well-tested model for providing food and medical assistance. The OP wondered where all the atheist soup kitchens were....no doubt there are some out there, but in general why would a secular group create a soup kitchen if that need was already being met? It would be like creating a competitor to the Red Cross because you don't like their logo or something.

However, many of the other needs I listed have not been traditional priorities for Christian charities. So there has been little in the way of infrastructure built up. These are needs that had to be met, and it is as likely you will find secular groups filling those needs as religious groups. In fact, in many cases I think you could argue that it was secular efforts that raised the awareness of some of the issues, and made the churches realize they needed to expand the scope of their own programs.

But it's not a competition, for chrissakes. It's about doing what needs to be done. It's already clear that alleviating the many problems of our society is beyond the scope of any one church program or halfway house. We all know it requires cooperation, not competition, to make life better.

And as for the arts, your indefatigable support for organ and choir music not withstanding, I think you know I had other, more hands-on assistance in mind.

No, I didn't know you had other things in mind, rather than performance of the arts. (Also giving. When I look at the donor lists at the Fairbanks musical arts organizations, I recognize about half of the major donors as people who are also very active in their churches. Where do you think they developed a love for classical music?

I do grant that the church is more than a bit dodgy when it comes to other arts. Christian drama is reserved, I am sure, for people who have been extra bad in this life. Hitler is now forced to watch more Christian drama than anyone alive could take. There are some extraordinary Christian writers (Updike, Percy, O' Connor, Greene) but they are the exception, not the rule.

And you are right, it is not a competition. (Although I would welcome a graceful competition between anyone if their goal is to see who can truly do more real good than the other--and the words "graceful competition" and "real good" are very important to this sentence.)

>12 southernbooklady: No, I didn't know you had other things in mind

Ah, okay. I apologize for coming down on you for not being a mind reader ;)

So given that you and I think of different things when it comes to "support for the arts," here are some of the things I'm involved in and were at the forefront of my mind:

--writing workshops for returning veterans
--after school arts programs for turnkey kids that give them access to instruments, cameras, film editing, etc.
--children's and community theater programs
-- scholarships for kids to attend art camps and writing conferences
--public radio
--oral history workshops and programs
etc, etc.

Most of the above in my community are orchestrated by secular, not religious groups. Although like anything else everyone works together where they can.

I think when comes to music, especially classical and often jazz, Churches are very involved. As I said, writing, and these days, painting, not so much. (Imagine though, where music and painting would be without the influence of the church. They were, in effect, the first concert halls and museums.)

You did know that I did commentaries for NPR in the late 90s and early aughts. And was an on-air volunteer for almost fifteen years. But that experience is pretty unique for pastors.

>15 Arctic-Stranger: You did know that I did commentaries for NPR

I used to do them for my local public radio station, not NPR. It was the best experience I ever received for being disciplined in my writing, because you only had a certain amount of time, there wasn't any flexibility, and you only had one shot at getting the listener's attention. No rewind on radio! So everything you said had to count.

> 3

Touche!

Acts of charity require neither religious belief nor an organization to perform. Donate your money to individuals (underwrite your uncle's invention so he can get a patent); buy a meal for that guy on the street who will work for food, only don't make him "pay you back"; tip generously all those who perform services for you -- wait staff, personal groomers, hotel housekeepers.

If you wish to act on a larger stage, then, indeed, you will need to find an organization. The more narrowly focused, the better chance your money will actually provide an immediate benefit to someone in need. Consider Shelterbox, for example. They provide instant housing supplied with life necessities for victims of cataclysmic events, getting their Shelterboxes on scene often within 72 hours.

Long term and sustained charity begins with financial and estate planning. Once again, the most effective choices are specific and narrowly focused. Like your public radio and TV stations, a regional museum, a scholarship, etc.

Generosity is a natural human impulse that is not exclusive to believers. Humanists and atheists can be just as effective as religiously affiliated people -- maybe more so, by carefully tailoring their decisions on how to go about expressing their giving sides.

>18 Limelite: Acts of charity require neither religious belief nor an organization to perform.

Your post says it all, Thank you.

Nandy was the name given to a Neanderthal male who's remains were unearthed in the mountains of Northern Iraq in 1968. His 48,000 year old remains showed that he lived well into adulthood despite being deformed from birth.

His disability showed he was mobile but could not have survived alone in his harsh environment, he must have been cared for within his community. He was buried with spring flowers and fruit placed upon his body.

The fact that we all exist today is clear proof that our ancestors had a structure, fed and cared for their young and the weak, thousand of years before Christianity arrived comparatively recently.

These are HUMAN values not Christian values. It is shocking that otherwise learned persons voice the opinion that we would descend into bestiality without their particular faith, or if we eat bacon sandwiches or wear odd socks on a Tuesday. This often from a church that until recently was burning people at the stake.

As >18 Limelite: says: "Generosity is a natural human impulse that is not exclusive to believers. Humanists and atheists can be just as effective as religiously affiliated people -- maybe more so." It is not a competition, there are no brownie points.