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Gödel, Escher, Bach: een eeuwige gouden band (1979)

door Douglas R. Hofstadter

Andere auteurs: Zie de sectie andere auteurs.

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11,925115381 (4.34)2 / 222
Douglas Hofstadter's book is concerned directly with the nature of "maps' or links between formal systems. However, according to Hofstadter, the formal system that underlies all mental activity transcends the system that supports it. If life can grow out of the formal chemical substrate of the cell, if consciousness can emerge out of a formal system of firing neurons, then so too will computers attain human intelligence. Gödel, Escher, Bach is a wonderful exploration of fascinating ideas at the heart of cognitive science: meaning, reduction, recursion, and much more.… (meer)
  1. 101
    Cryptonomicon door Neal Stephenson (Zaklog)
    Zaklog: Cryptonomicon strikes me as the kind of book that Hofstadter would write if he wrote fiction. Both books are complex, with discursive passages on mathematics and a positively weird sense of humor. If you enjoyed (rather than endured) the explanatory sections on cryptography and the charts of Waterhouse's love life (among other, rarely charted things) you should really like this book.… (meer)
  2. 60
    Logicomix door Apostolos Doxiadis (tomduck, EerierIdyllMeme)
    EerierIdyllMeme: An obvious suggestion (surprised it's not here already). Both are creative and fictional riffing off of formal logic and incompleteness.
  3. 50
    Metamagische thema's op zoek naar de essentie van geest en patroon door Douglas R. Hofstadter (JFDR)
  4. 40
    Incompleteness: The Proof and Paradox of Kurt Gödel door Rebecca Goldstein (michaeljohn)
  5. 20
    A Mathematician Reads the Newspaper door John Allen Paulos (heidialice)
    heidialice: GEB is a thousand times as intense, but if you enjoyed the parts about self-referentiality it's worth a skim. Conversely, if GEB is just too much, Paulos' concise introduction to the theme is very accessible.
  6. 00
    Things to Make and Do in the Fourth Dimension door Matt Parker (Lorem)
    Lorem: Things in 4D I consider a more accessible version of GEB in its breadth and how it does get to complex topics. If you enjoyed the more complicated parts of 4D, definitely look at GEB and if GEB was a little too much, 4D might remind you why math(s) are never boring… (meer)
  7. 00
    The Gold Bug Variations door Richard Powers (hippietrail)
  8. 33
    A New Kind of Science door Stephen Wolfram (Anonieme gebruiker)
  9. 01
    Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency door Douglas Adams (EerierIdyllMeme)
    EerierIdyllMeme: A few similar themes (Bach, human cognition) come up in similar ways.
  10. 03
    Het paneel van Vlaanderen door Arturo Pérez-Reverte (P_S_Patrick)
    P_S_Patrick: Arturo Perez-Reverte has recieved inspiration for his excellent mystery thriller from Hofstadter's Godel Escher Bach, even without some of the chapter introduciton quotes, that much is clear. He uses the bewildering Escherian theme of worlds within a world, Godels incompleteness theorum is alluded to in the monologue of one character, and Bach is discussed in relevance to the mystery too, along with a few miscellaneous paradoxes which are also slipped in, in a similar spirit in which they permeate the more complex non-fictional work. Non-fiction readers who have enjoyed GEB should be amused by the Flanders panel, and I think they should enjoy it even if they do not often dip into fiction. It would be harder to recommend GEB to fans of the Flanders Panel, due to its sheer length, but if you were intrigued by the themes in the story then it should at least be worth finding GEB in a library and dipping into it.… (meer)
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A lot of content to sift through, but plenty of gems to be found. Much of the content, with the exception of a handful of technical terms, is still entirely relevant today, though, that may speak to lack of progress in the feld of AI over the last 40 years. I also felt that the style of progression put forth by the author, which is to "present new concepts twice", was, more often than not, worse than the following "formal abstract presentation" and a bit little too whimsical (whimsy) for my taste (especially for nonfiction). Overall, I'd recommend the read! ( )
  mitchanderson | Jan 17, 2021 |
This book is an excellent filter for certain kinds of people -- those who love it are likely to love systems and logic at an advanced level (beyond simple A -> B -> C), those who don't probably strongly prefer people. I suspect "did you like this book" would be highly predictive of future careers. I first read it when I was ~12, took months and was equal parts confused and intrigued, and then re-read a few years later and appreciated it even more. I think it was the first truly dense and difficult book I'd encountered. I was already "sold" on math and science at the time, but it mainly opened my interests to include music and art. ( )
  octal | Jan 1, 2021 |
I was hoping that Hofstadter's book would be my first five star review for 2012. Unfortunately, I'm going to have to wait a bit longer. I was very disappointed. The author says several times that he first envisioned this work as a pamphlet. I wish he'd stuck to that. The book is too long, poorly edited and the at first cute intervening dialogues between fictional characters become unbelievably annoying. The worst part of this book for me is the author's continual arrogance. He comes off as ever so clever, more so than his poor readers. How this book won a Pulitzer Prize (1980, general nonfiction) is almost beyond me. Perhaps the reviewers couldn't understand the book but thought they should and passed it's 700 pages off as award quality.

Maybe I would have enjoyed this book a little more if I'd read it as a sophomore in college, when I was introduced to artificial intelligence in my computer science major. I enjoyed Hofstadter's book with its quick reminder of several courses I took, including abstract algebra, computer theory, AI, programming and logic. I say reminder rather than refresher since I doubt I could have learned these concepts via his writings. He talks deep but uses cutesy language that serves, for me, to obscure what he's getting at rather than enlighten. This book paired with some other textbooks and a good professor would have been nice. To be of use today, though, the book needs to be updated. It shows its age, having been writing in the late 1970s. The 20th Anniversary addition only includes an updated preface, no extra epilogues, chapters, or thoughts on the field that so entranced a young Hofstadter at the dawn of his career.



( )
  drew_asson | Dec 3, 2020 |
Thanks Doug, I am now convinced that mathematics is self aware.
  Raykoda3 | Sep 25, 2020 |
I've been thinking about reading this book for years. Probably since 1979, when it was first published, in fact. This is the 20th anniversary edition, and other than a new introduction by the author, where he acknowledges some of his bad predictions (e.g., the inability of a computer to beat a human chess champion), the text is unchanged. This is both good and bad, I suppose. Since over 40 years have passed, and one of the major themes of the book is artificial intelligence, the lengthy discussions of how well it might be able to work are seriously dated. On the other hand, the intricate connections between the amusing conversations between Achilles, the Tortoise, the Crab, and later, the Sloth are very interconnected with the "straight" chapters with which they alternate. This book seems to flow from topic to topic almost randomly, but it all sort of hangs together. It will probably hang together even better if you really understand Hofstadter's flights into mathematics, number theory, and logic. At times, I got lost and there were a couple of times when I was afraid the book was going to become too dense to continue, but then it would take off in a different direction and the pleasure of reading it would return. In the end, I guess my takeaway is that the mind is a wonderfully complex thing; we can never never know for sure what we know; but through isomorphism, we can make sense out of a lot of things that seem daunting at first--like this book.

Also, to correct one egregious mistake--Dvorak was never deaf. Hofstadter means Smetana, who in addition to being deaf, was also insane at the end of his life. ( )
1 stem datrappert | Aug 30, 2020 |
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» Andere auteurs toevoegen (23 mogelijk)

AuteursnaamRolType auteurWerk?Status
Hofstadter, Douglas R.primaire auteuralle editiesbevestigd
尚紀, 柳瀬VertalerSecondaire auteursommige editiesbevestigd
Feuersee, HermannVertalerSecondaire auteursommige editiesbevestigd
Jonkers, RonaldVertalerSecondaire auteursommige editiesbevestigd
Wahlén, JanVertalerSecondaire auteursommige editiesbevestigd
Wolff-Windegg, PhilipVertalerSecondaire auteursommige editiesbevestigd
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In its absolute barest form, Gödel's discovery involves the translation of an ancient paradox in philosophy into mathematical terms. That paradox is the so-called Epimenides paradox, or liar paradox. Epimenides was a Cretan who made one immortal statement: “All Cretans are liars.”
Whereas the Epimenides statement creates a paradox since it is neither true nor false, the Gödel sentence G is unprovable (inside P.M.) but true. The grand conclusion? That the system of Principia Mathematica is “incomplete”—there are true statements of number theory which its methods of proof are too weak to demonstrate.
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Douglas Hofstadter's book is concerned directly with the nature of "maps' or links between formal systems. However, according to Hofstadter, the formal system that underlies all mental activity transcends the system that supports it. If life can grow out of the formal chemical substrate of the cell, if consciousness can emerge out of a formal system of firing neurons, then so too will computers attain human intelligence. Gödel, Escher, Bach is a wonderful exploration of fascinating ideas at the heart of cognitive science: meaning, reduction, recursion, and much more.

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